BXProject

[docchevron132]

nah, we're good at inventing, the the japs nick our idea's and make it cheaper...

[mickey taker]

a bit like the Brits nicking the German DKW RT 125 and selling it as the BSA D1 Bantam back in 1948 that was done as as war reparation though

[Father Ted]

Methadone (Adolphine) was a Nazi invention, and actually quite a clever one, the very first fully synthetic opiod that acts as morphine would locking onto the mu receptors in both the brain and gut, used in pain relief with the advantage that one dose would last 24 hours - nicked by the yanks at the end of the war and sold as a health tonic (Physeptone) before lots of peope became addicted, then used first in palliative care then in drug addiction. It took the yanks a LOOOOOOOOONG time to manufacture another synthetic oipiod - now the market is awash with them.

I suppose there are lots of things invented by one person and robbed by another...

[Fish_Botherer]

nah, we're good at inventing, the the japs nick our idea's and make it cheaper...

Or we just pretty much give them away, if you look a little further back. I was reading a bit of 20th century history lately which had a couple of interesting variations.

(1) In the 1920s and 30s many Japanese students were allegedly trained-up in Lancashire on the textile industry - cue Japan displacing the UK in these markets shortly thereafter.

(2) Also, an official mission was sent in the 1920s to assist and train the Japanese in developing the field of naval aviation (i.e. Aircraft carriers and torpedo bombers). Didn't they do well.....

On a slightly different theme, Nissan/Datsun used to make Austin 7's more-or-less under license in the 1930s, then made Austins under license in the 1950s, before using the patent exploitation terms of this agreement to redesign the A and B-series engines for use in the first wave of Datsuns for export to Europe and elsewhere. You could argue they were welcome to them, but at least they developed them. They then did a similar thing with some Mercedes engine technology (to be even-handed). OK - I did lean on wikipedia a little there to remind myself how far that might have gone.

[Philhod]

Your 20th century history lesson appears correct, partly, at least the bit I have learned quite a lot about. Cotton.
It's true that there were a lot of aisian "apprentices" learned their trade here in Wigan and surrounding towns. Tere were also lots from America, Egypt and India where cotton is grown.
unfortunately only parts of Japan and China are able to spin the stuff into thread, however knowledgeable the students became.
The reason all the cotton mills are in Lancashire and wool on the other side of the hills, is the climate cotton will only draw and join in a damp atmosphere which we have in spades.
Over in Y*******e, it's much drier so they do wool which doesn't require the damp.

There is nowhere suitable in America or Egypt and it cost them a lot to find that out.
There are a couple of places in both Japan and China that subsequently went into high volume production. their quality was good but the finishing processes of bleaching and dyeing was very inferior to ours and therefore didn't cut much into our markets.
The killer for the industry really, was more the abundance of cheap Nylon and other polymers that became available in the 1950's with the finishing processes not required at all.

[docchevron132]

Fuck, this is by far the best car related website of EvAh!

I mean, where else can you get techy info, shoot the shit, rip the piss AND get a fucking history lesson all in the same place for free!?

[Philhod]

Sorry still in teaching mode

[Fish_Botherer]

Always glad to learn more, Phil - thanks for that.

The book to which I was referring (Andrew Marr's "A History of Modern Britain" ) skips the nitty-gritty of the textile industry in favour of the author trying to making a neater point. So did I, as he was talking about calico rather than a higher-grade finished cotton product.

[Way2go]

nitty-gritty

Also a term that is supposed to be consigned to history as non-pc etc. Refers to the dead slaves that were lying at the bottom of the holds of slave ships after they unloaded the live "cargo".

[Father Ted]

he was talking about calico rather than a higher-grade finished cotton product.

Fascinating history, Tardy Gate Manufacturing Company built in 1908 by a co operative of workers, they went bust and all four directors blew their brains out on the shop floor. Taken over and expanded by Thomas Moss and company the mill carried on making calico and sail cloth until its closure in 1978 which saw the land sold off (and the cricket pitch owned by the mill was built upon - which is where my house is) the lodge drained and filled in and initially the building taken over by an abattoir. Sold to Todds in 1981 it became home to a number of industrial units and motor caravan dealership. Thankfully most of the external architecture is preserved, and interestingly quite a lot of the original wheel gear is visible in the loft of the engine room (now a garage) though in the mill itself nothing remains.

Ironic - the lodge is now a car park

[Philhod]

We used to have a lot of that type of building but all the one andtwo storey ones were pulled down ages ago as Wigans mills were the first to close. We Have 3 major multi storey mills left. One used to house the college construction, business and motor vehicle sections but has now been sold off for rather up market apartment development.
Another houses the biggest working tripple expansion steam engine in europe, along with a working weaving shed, the rest of it being, you've guessed, posh flats.
The 3rd one is a sprawling affair and has become a multi industrial site of units, has got run down and wants pulling down for me.
The earlier closure of our mills is also the reason we don't have an Indian/ Paki comunity. (or any others )
They all moved east with the work, Bolton, Bury, Oldham, Rochdale, Blackburn etc.

[Way2go]

Wigans mills were the first to close.

No doubt this led to the dilapidation of the pier.

[docchevron132]

Sorry still in teaching mode

No apolagy required mate, this really is fucking fascinating!

[Philhod]

No doubt this led to the dilapidation of the pier.

No mate The pier is alive and well (on the heritage trail) and had nothing to do with cotton
Anyway.

What it was (is?) a set of railway lines that bend up at 90 degrees. Coal trucks were shoved against it, then hyrdaulically lifted ( by canal water) to tip their load into the waiting barges.

I said on a thread here once before this place has transformed into a clean modern living environment, in the last 50 years. When I was growing up at was one big industrial shit tip.
Full of factory chimneys coal dust everywhere, big railway centre (steam) Pits still working and there were a lot of them in fact 12 within a radius of 5 miles from my house. Everything was polluted. There was a municians works 1/4 mile from my mam's, which drained it's waste oil into a local stream, running in a little valley. All the grass would dry up, soaked in oil and we would take great delight in setting it on fire in the winter. would burn for fucking hours, keeping us warm.
The thick black smoke was a bit of a bastard though

[Fish_Botherer]

I do sometimes wonder what all the hydrocarbons, and assorted crap that got erm.. liberated in the course of the 20th-century's various wars, produced as by-products - or dumped afterwards - did for the environment. But then the numbers in general (with the exception of human casualties) are dwarfed by the numbers of vehicles and planes around today or produced since. I also think a single large volcanic eruption can chuck out an awful lot more material in a short time than man's ever managed.

Strange effects of wars on the sea:

Whales took a hammering in the battle of the Atlantic as a result of anti-submarine measures as they represented a big sonar signature and hence could be interpreted as a threat to convoys.

Stocks of herring and other fish in the North Sea and other regions increased markedly during the duration of WW2 because there was virtually no commercial exploitation of them during that time. It didn't take long for the fishing fleets to do them in again afterwards, though.

[Philhod]

Whales took a hammering in the battle of the Atlantic

Bollox mate, Wales never came under attack, we never got any U boot's in the Irish sea.

Fishing was done by lots of small boats till the 50's and fish was a good cheap wholesome staple diet up here.
Then frozen food arrived and factory ships appeared. Then the fish disappeared.
prices doubled and err have done ever since, with boring regularity.

Think about this Bandit; early in the Battle of the Atlantic, IN ONE MONTH, over a million tons of shipping went to the bottom.
That was oil tankers, petrol ships, as well as other noxious substances. Fortunately the ships fuel was mostly coal, so that at least was not a pollutant

Jesus there's been some change, when you think about it.
No fridge or freezer, no central heating or double glazing and no electrickery either in our case, till 1952. But we were much better off coz there was no fucking supermarkets to bleed you of £ 100 a week

[docchevron132]

Ahhh, we venture towards the environment!
Man has had a lot less impact than the global governments would have us believe.
In short, it's all bollocks.
Ok, yes, without doubt we have had *some* impact, but the tiniest amount imaginable.
Global Warming was a myth, so they changed he name to Climate Change.
But is it doing anything outside of the earths usual pattern?
Erm.... NO!

[Philhod]

Yeah, that's right Doc. The sea actually recycles shit with consumate ease and if you believe these guys who are predicting a mini ice age like I do...........
They have been studying samples from deep in the ice in Greenland and have found several episodes when the ice has melted causing the Gulf stream to stop.
This coupled with evidence from other parts of Northern europe means that anytime soon this episode will come on within 10 years and last for up to 90.

Oh forgot to mention that our winters willbe on a par with Norway and Canada.

[Father Ted]

Better get some S & M tyres for the Micra then...

[docchevron132]

Kinky!